I second Jim's statements. Without a third party oversight this whole thing could be loaded with fraud. Some of these same "natural" farmers still use agricultural products from the "local" elevator. The same GMO corn and soybeans that the organic people would definitely lose certification over! A lot of these same people also still think that roundup herbicide is OK because it so short lived...
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Jim Moses 
  To: [log in to unmask] 
  Sent: Wednesday, March 14, 2007 10:57 AM
  Subject: Re: FW: [SANET-MG] organic vs. local...

  Regarding Certified Naturally Grown--

       I checked this label out two years ago and was not impressed.  They claimed that their "standards" were the same as NOP.  But at that time you could access application forms of certified growers and many listed violations of NOP standards like prohibited inputs, commercial transplants, treated seed etc.
       It is time to deal seriously with nostalgia for the "good old days" of organic agriculture, that never really existed.  The fraud and ignorance that existed when everyone had their own standard is nothing we should want to return.  There is a cost involved in offering the public third-party certified organic products.  Anyone who wants to make these claims should be willing to contribute.  If you want to identify who is getting the short end of the stick, ask yourself this.  What about the growers who pay their dues and receive no protection from the state and federal agencies who are pledged to eliminate fraud?  What about the increasing number of questionable labels backed by foundation money that undermine certified organic?  What about the whole phony "Local" verses "Organic" campaign that clearly has some BIG money behind it?  Divide and conqueror, it is an old story, but it still works.

  Jim Moses

  Vicki Morrone <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
    Hey folks
    This is an interesting alternative to certified organic and probably
    would do well at small markets and farmers markets, at this time. But
    then a farmer could combine organic certification with the farmer pledge
    that MOFFA is promoting and cover all the bases and be able to sell
    foods labeled organic.

    Have you looked into Certified Naturally Grown? It's a great
    alternative and self governing as it was in the old days of Organic. You
    rely on other local farmers, customers or the County Extension to inpect
    your farm.
    It's a non profit organization. They do ask for donations and they also
    sell stickers with the CNG logo. You can download brochures online for
    hand outs explaining the program. The website address is
    They have a questionaire to cover all aspects of Naturally Grown so
    inspection is easy and informative to the consumer, too. 
    I wonder if this program is catching on yet in California? 

    -----Original Message-----
    >From: Douglas Hinds 
    >Sent: Mar 10, 2007 3:03 PM
    >To: [log in to unmask]
    >Subject: Re: [SANET-MG] organic vs. local...

    most left because of the State and USDA take over of the
    >> word organic, we were the volunteers of America now we are forced
    >> slaves to the USDA the certifier and the inspector and the state.
    >> On years like this one with the freeze they make their money even
    >> when I loose money. hehe . My customers that I had for years
    >> forced me to be certified after the USDA takeover if I wanted to
    >> keep selling to them so if I want to tell my customer I'm organic
    >> I have to pay the organic police.

    >We knew this would happen, ahead of time, of course (and there
    >weren't that many of us that knew what to expect).
    >> I pay a organic tax because I don't use anything.
    >You pay the penalty for the OFPA's having the wrong focus. (And third
    >party certification became a big industry, with greater authority
    >than the farmers themselves, thanks to OFPA).
    >> I have to fill out reports and pay the USDA saying I don't use
    >> anything while the USDA will not label GMOs, pesticides,
    >> herbicides, fertilizers that kill life on the earth. Its all
    >> backwards.

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